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Dying issue, Hmmm Cant post in Tech Support forum.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 4:00 pm
by rp23g7
I have posted there before, anyway.

My 88 Reliant 2.5 has been having a problem with stalling. I have played around with the circumstances and have found a few things.

It seems to be a key cycle/time in Drive issue. It seems to die, once, every nine key cycles. I was playing around with the circumstances, i thought it may be a running time issue, or a time/distance issue, as it has died in the same spot twice.

So, this morning was its ninth start, and i had a feeling it was going to die on me. So i started it, and put it in Drive, and let it idle as i waited for my wife, well, it died, about a 1/4 mile down the road, which, if calculated the time in drive would be about the same time it took to drive to the stop light it has died at a few times.

But today i outsmarted it. When it does die, usually, you can crank and crank and it will catch and die again, wait a few seconds, and it starts and runs and dies again, you can continue to do this and on the 6th cycle or so it will catch and be fine. But this morning it dies and i pull over and we sit for 4 or 5 min with the key off, tried starting it, and it starts back up. All is well on the drive to work etc. Funny thing is, also, when it does this, it seems to idle better for the next few key cycles too, it sometimes idles like its missing on a cylinder but runs fine at cruise speed etc.

I have checked codes, and have two, i forgot the numbers but one is something to do with the Part Throttle solenoid, and the other is a Vehicle Speed sensor code, neither seem relevant to the dying issue.

Any ideas?

Re: Dying issue, Hmmm Cant post in Tech Support forum.

PostPosted: Tue Apr 12, 2011 6:16 pm
by K-CAR_WAGON
You can't post to the technical support section because there is a known problem with that section of the board (which has not been fixed for at least a month). You can only access that section as a guest. If you are logged-in you cannot view that section, but if you are a guest you can view that section.

As for your problem, I recommend that you identify the codes and fix the problems as a starting point. See link to lists of codes:
http://chryslerkcar.freeforums.org/codes-t6.html

I don't know why you assume your fault codes have nothing to do with the problem. Throttle problems relate to fuel mixture and can make the car run improperly. As for why the car acts differently after a short time, the computer may be transitioning the car from an open loop control mode of operation to a closed loop control of operation using feedback. (Similar to a carb car running on choke and then transitioning off choke based on time and/or temperature.)

If it idles likes it missing a cylinder - it probably is missing on a cylinder. Did you do a basic tune up like plugs, wires, cap, rotor, hall sensor module. Maybe you have a fouled plug or a bad wire. Could also have weak spark. When you have the plugs out measure the compression on the cylinders - maybe you do have bad compression on one cylinder.

Its not unusal for a car with poor idle to operate reasonably well at higher crusie speeds.

Re: Dying issue, Hmmm Cant post in Tech Support forum.

PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 2:11 am
by duked
i seem to rememebr someone saying they had problems with the car dying and it ended up being the speed sensor. but its unfortunatly lost to the service forum.

Re: Dying issue, Hmmm Cant post in Tech Support forum.

PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 3:52 am
by Butch
Speed sensior could be the problem as well as a dirty T/body. The sensor will spit out a code, the T/body can be clean with T/body cleaner.

Re: Dying issue, Hmmm Cant post in Tech Support forum.

PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2011 12:39 pm
by Chief
I'm with Butch, it sounds like it might be a throttle body problem.

Re: Dying issue, Hmmm Cant post in Tech Support forum.

PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2011 4:13 am
by Jacks1986Lebaron
Some good tips for possible causes of stalling here:

http://www.allpar.com/fix/stall.html

Good Luck and let us know when you find out the cause of yours.

Re: Dying issue, Hmmm Cant post in Tech Support forum.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2011 3:25 pm
by rp23g7
HMMM I am kinda leaning toward a Closed to Open Loop issue, as it usually does it about the same times in the morning, depending on the amount of time idleing. I dont understand how it could be a Speed Sensor issue as it does it when it hasnt moved all night and does it in the morning, or after a cold/hot/cold cycle.

I will check the code numbersa again, one is the speed sensor code, 37 i think, and the other is a Part Throttle solenoid code. I agree on the Hall Effect Sensor or bad plugs/rotor for the idleing issue though, it just had a tune up about 1000 miles ago.

Re: Dying issue, Hmmm Cant post in Tech Support forum.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2011 5:34 pm
by rp23g7
Ok, so i disconnected the battery for 10 min or so, reattached, and drove 1/4 mile to the freeway, 20 miles on the freeway at about 60-65, got off and stopped with the engine shut off for 10 min or so, drove back on the freeway the same way and checked the codes when i got back.

I got

12 ...of course, battery disconnected

15...No speed/distance sensor signal

37...Part throttle unlock (PTU) solenoid circuit is open or shorted

55.... End of message

No stalling on the trip, i will keep track of the key cycles and see what happens.

Re: Dying issue, Hmmm Cant post in Tech Support forum.

PostPosted: Fri Apr 15, 2011 9:21 pm
by K-CAR_WAGON
I recommend fixing the car so the fault codes go away and maybe your problem with go away. Take a look at some of these links. It gives more details. Proper idel can be affected by code 15 fault; proper vacuum control can be affected by code 37 fault.

http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/fault/

http://dodgeram.info/Engine-Gas/OBDI/Fault-15.htm

Re: Dying issue, Hmmm Cant post in Tech Support forum.

PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2011 5:01 am
by rp23g7
is the part throttle sensor the little solenoidon the right fender with one line attached to the side and one open verticle tube? Is the speed sensor the connector you can see by the trans fluid dipstick or is it under the car on the right halfshaft.