Engine is shutting down really rough

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Engine is shutting down really rough

Postby Iain_James » Mon Sep 21, 2015 9:31 pm

I have an 84 Plymouth reliant wagon , 2.2 I've been trying to find out why this problem is and how to fix it for a while now. So what happens is not f the engine has been running for a while or it is hot out side, the engine shuts down loudly and roughly like it still has fuel or pressure in it. Afterwards the car won't start until it cools down usually about an hour. I've been told that this issue is from a faulty hall effect sensor/ pickup coil, or that it has nothing to do with that and that the timing is off and set to far a head. Any help in identifying this issue would be awesome and most appreciated thanks!
Iain_James
 
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:19 am
Car Information: 1984 Plymouth Reliant

Re: Engine is shutting down really rough

Postby Kwagon2 » Tue Sep 22, 2015 1:06 am

Without actually having the engine in hand and seeing whats going on I can only guess, so these are my guesses....Does the engine return to a decent idle after acceleration? If it does this would indicate that the computer is seeing the carb switch and recognizing the idle position, if your advance is up and staying there you would not have normal idle speed the engine speed would be excessive.
Failure of the computer to advance or retard timing in accordance with the vacuum signal it sees would effect drivability as well. Is the computer seeing the correct vacuum signal?...check your hose routing diagram.
Are the spark plugs the correct heat range?
Is there a strong fuel odor around the engine or at the tailpipe while its running ? Flooding but not enough to kill the engine the nitrile floats in the carb have a habit of absorbing fuel and not maintaining carb float level and therefore mixture.
Has the timing belt been replaced ...the thinking here is cam timing may be off effecting the engines compression etc.
Is the engine missfiring, if the engine is misfiring that could point to the hall effect pickup , the pickup is just a trigger for the computer to fire the ignition coil if its doing that the pickup is good to answer that question.
Another longshot here is the exhaust system ...do you have a collapsed muffler or is a cat plugged causing excessive back pressure...the engine would be a pain to start and it would be super sluggish when driven...
Again these are just guesses...I myself am just getting back into the 2.2 world after a long absence...
Kwagon2
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Car Information: '82 Aries Wagon,'85 Reliant SE,'82 Reliant Wagon

Re: Engine is shutting down really rough

Postby Iain_James » Tue Sep 22, 2015 6:41 pm

The idle seems to be fine when the car is running, I only smell fuel when it first starts, I'm currently getting the exhaust system looked at. I just drove about 5 miles and the car isn't starting, the temperature gauge is saying that its not to hot, its not wanting to turn over. Occasionally it will sound like the engine will start but just dies. The hoses could be connected in the wrong place but I have know idea where I can find the right diagram to know for sure. The guy I had work on it , I now know was fairly incompetent and seems to have made things slightly worse then they were before. I will replace the pick up coil and all that to make sure its not the issue. Other then that I am not sure what to do
Iain_James
 
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:19 am
Car Information: 1984 Plymouth Reliant

Re: Engine is shutting down really rough

Postby Iain_James » Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:17 am

I did end up replacing the pick up assembly, it seems to have made a big difference, I'm going to also replace the rotor and distributor cap as well the rotor seems to be really worn
Iain_James
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:19 am
Car Information: 1984 Plymouth Reliant

Re: Engine is shutting down really rough

Postby Kwagon2 » Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:06 pm

Well at least you're making progress! ...I've had the pickups fail completely resulting in a no-start scenario.
You had mentioned you didn't know where to get the hose routing diagram...is it not on the cowl below the windshield? I have a few starting in '84 so if you need I'll have to figure out how to post images on this site...
Please continue to post your progress...
Kwagon2
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Posts: 140
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Car Information: '82 Aries Wagon,'85 Reliant SE,'82 Reliant Wagon

Re: Engine is shutting down really rough

Postby Iain_James » Wed Sep 23, 2015 11:39 pm

Its there but really faded and unreadable. The problem is still there it just died on me again. So now I'm thinking its either timing or something to do with gases not leaving the engine when the engine is shut off.it seems to get fairly hot too, but the temperature gauge is just under the halfway mark. I got the muffler and the exhaust line fixed and the cat checked out so that's all good.I have no idea on how to check the timing or I would do that myself
Iain_James
 
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:19 am
Car Information: 1984 Plymouth Reliant

Re: Engine is shutting down really rough

Postby Kwagon2 » Fri Sep 25, 2015 2:00 am

Do you have an inductive clip timing light and an Electronic Tachometer? If you do let me know and I'll write up instructions for you. Also Check if you have the underhood Emissions label as it gives you the basic timing spec.
Kwagon2
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Posts: 140
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Car Information: '82 Aries Wagon,'85 Reliant SE,'82 Reliant Wagon

Re: Engine is shutting down really rough

Postby Iain_James » Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:39 am

i dont have either but maybe i can rent them from oreily or something? i just replaced the computer, and will be replacing the radiator hoses. ive got a chiltons for the car, but i am still at a loss for the vacuum hose diagram. im looking at the vapor canister, and the line that goes to the gas tank isnt connected, there seems to be some kind of filter and doesnt go any farther then that. on the bottom of the vapor canister is a place for another hose but i have no idea where it is supposed to go, its not on the diagram, its a larger hose about a half inch in diameter, im guessing it is supposed to attach somewhere on the top half of the engine but im not seeing where it is supposed to go. im going to be taking the car to get the emissions tested tomorrow hopefully it will pass so i can finally get it registered and get plates for it. i will also take a photo of the engine of where the vacuum lines are currently at maybe you can see if theres something not connected properly or maybe know of someone who might know.
Iain_James
 
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:19 am
Car Information: 1984 Plymouth Reliant

Re: Engine is shutting down really rough

Postby Kwagon2 » Thu Oct 08, 2015 12:21 am

Hello Again!
I'll be glad to have a look at your engine when you get the picture up...I just came across a bit of a surprise
I was at a used book store and came across a Haynes manual for Aries /Reliant 1981 to 1989 and these aren't a bad manual at all...lots of good "practical" stuff I picked it up for $5! well the surprise was that the manual has a set of vacuum hose routing diagrams nothing for the really early stuff like mine, but it has them for '84 to '86 Federal, California and Canada.
The book has a great set of instructions with illustrations for checking timing on 2.2's and 2.6's etc. along with tons of other stuff.
There's, also lots of info on emission and carb systems including full overhaul instructions for the carbs etc. A pretty decent little manual which could help you out and you'd have it "on hand" instead of waiting for return posts etc.
I checked and there are lots on ebay if you want to scoop one and they aren't charging much either....yes?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HAYNES-723-Repa ... ee&vxp=mtr
Kwagon2
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Posts: 140
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Car Information: '82 Aries Wagon,'85 Reliant SE,'82 Reliant Wagon

Re: Engine is shutting down really rough

Postby Iain_James » Sat Oct 10, 2015 5:17 pm

i went ahead and ordered a copy of that book, i also however got myself a meter to read the idle rpms, in which it seems to be running 300rpms too fast. the idle speed listed is 900rpm. the only thing is i am unsure on what needs to be done to adjust it. i know where to adjust it. im just talking about if theres any other steps i need to do to do it. oh i also passed emissions, no issues at all, i think they were kind of surprised how well the car actually did lol
now i am working on the upper and lower radiator hoses, as well as the transmission cooling hoses. I am also still trying to figure out the vapor canister, and the connections trying to figure out where one of them goes. so far i havent found the answer online or in books.
Iain_James
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2015 2:19 am
Car Information: 1984 Plymouth Reliant

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